I am just wondering what are the insurance companies thinking? Why should they pay for a c section when an abortion would be cheaper? Why pay for blood infusions when abortions are cheaper? And aren't these examples more of a liability for hospitals?
The other thing I been thinking why then should a doctor have to treat a patient because they don't like the patient's race, sex, religion? Would a law this stupid cover that? Or why should a doctor treat an overweight person in the ER if they could be there because of complications from their weight? This just doesn't end.
As to the hospitals- so many are owned now by Catholics, & we know they aren’t doing anything that resembles an abortion.
That is something else we need to start agitating for; the DOJ to bring an antitrust lawsuit against them & stop them from buying up any more hospitals. They are becoming a monopoly
For the life of me, I cannot understand why no doctor is saying on air "it is the responsibility of the physician to treat patients according to their individual needs, not according to the political or ideological or religious beliefs of the physician."
I mean, they'd probably need to be ready to retire, but there are plenty of those. Also plenty willing to take the harassment that would come at them. But this was at least at one time spoken of as how medicine was supposed to be, before the culture shift. Now, for a subset, it's "I don't want to" said like a toddler. Get over yourself and treat your patient. Patient comes first. Freaking always.
I was really surprised that the Comstock Law is still on the books. It is the law that can be used to charge people with mailing abortifacients, but it also provides for much more that could be used to control women's choices. The law criminalizes mailing birth control, including pills, condoms, diaphragms etc. It forbids mailing information about women's productive health. I have no doubt that the radical right will eventually take advantage of this. Maybe we should be encouraging our representatives to work to repeal the Comstock law, especially if the Democrats retake the house.
Yeah. What I don't understand is why we can't turn it on them and bring a suit that outlaws the mailing of, say, Viagra? The Comstock Act is pretty broad in saying anything "obscene, lewd or lascivious." That could encompass a lot today, most notably Viagra. Why do we have to just focus on what is says re abortion? I am confused by that, genuinely.
Comstock needs to go. If mailing "indecent materials" or however it is phrased is illegal, how long is it before homes are raided for mailing artwork that is deemed inappropriate? Imagine a swat team coming into your home, yourself on the news in handcuffs in your pajamas, or imprisoned. Tangential, but, physicians in this country get raided at home and in their offices by SWAT teams at gunpoint and have their bank accounts and homes seized before they can even hire attorneys FOR PRESCRIBING controlled substances to people in hospice at normal doses under drug war policy. There's been a suicide of a disabled patient post raid who had a gun pointed at their head during a raid. You can bring up footage of some of this online. One physician had a retinal detachment and a heart attack while in prison waiting for a trial. Often the "trials" are administrative law judges of the DEA behind closed doors without a jury and no one is allowed in. Some of these guys are released after years in prison and lives ruined, because they were found innocent, long after being smeared in the media. I see Comstock with "indecent" materials, contraception, abortion, going the same way. Steps to complete control. I don't do well at home; I definitely couldn't manage in a US prison, and I don't want to have to depend on some nut job's idea of what is decent for all my thoughts, activities, entertainment, etc., and that is where they want to take us.
I was actually slightly heartened by Barrett yesterday. While she is not, in general, someone I approve of, she seemed to actually understand the concept of women’s health in the arguments.
This time, don't be fooled. She has said in the past it is no hardship to have a child you can't afford, just drop it off at the nearest fire department.
Barrett is conservative, and she signed on to Dobbs, but she's not a caricature, and she's not a completely unreasonable human being. Oddly enough, none of Trump's three justices, problematic as they are, are as bad as Thomas and Alito (and Son of Sam seems to get worse every year). Not to defend them, for anyone else reading, but just to say that there still seem to be degrees here, and I'm not sure it's helpful to throw every conservative in the same pile, especially when it seems like promoting divisions between them is one of the best ways to stop this onslaught of evil in this country.
Amanda Marcotte in Salon: "Erin Hawley is the latest in a long line of Republican women who have built successful careers by destroying the lives of other women." There really is a special place in hell for the women who do the patriarchy's dirty work and destroy the lives of other women. They think the rules they make for other women won't apply to them.
She's also Josh Hawley's "beard". There is an internet picture of him kissing her, he is as far away from her as he can be, looking like Alfalfa in the little rascals, when he lost a bet and had to kiss Darla. That is not a man who likes women.
Well said a Terri. Sadly some women choose to adopt the “ladder” approach. The style men have been using for years. Two people can’t stand on the same rung. So they push the other person down or up to get ahead and take their place. Every man and woman for themselves mentality. 🤨
Erin Hawley would be the first one to sue the hospital if she lost too much blood or damage done to an organ because of a miscarriage that she had to wait until near death.
Thank you for your outrage, written persuasively. I hardly know what to do with mine. I’m reading the the book “Birth Strike” by Jenny Brown. And here’s a graph from it about the charge Anthony Comstock (who helped outlaw contraception & abortion here in 1873) himself was leading in U.S. between 1860-1880: “He and his minions proceeded to conduct a reign of terror against abortion providers, purveyors of birth control advice, feminist and anarchist speakers, free-love advocates, novelists who mentioned sex, and booksellers....Pill, potions, devices and information on birth control could no longer be sold or sent through the mail”
In the late 1800s!!! Lawrence with Sen. Whitehouse did a segment very recently on how the right wing extremists like Leo network are training judges and lawyers in what is called 'history and tradition doctrine' to interpret the constitution through that perverted lens. With the SCOTUS we have now, yeah, they can drag us back, way back to that period.
Not just women. I'm a woman, and I feel as you do, but it's worth adding, this is a window for them to control whomever they want. If we don't stop this now, anyone who pokes their head up or has a contrary thought will be in danger. Think AI. AI, protected by proprietary formulation, is being applied already to medicine without FDA approval, which is supposed to be required, in order to supposedly stop doctor shopping, but really your medication records in most states are open to law enforcement without subpoena or warrant, and they can set you up and use you as they wish if you are slightly out of the ordinary, which many people are without having committed any crime.
Great job on Alex Wagner tonight! Also a big thank you to Alex Wagner for her reporting. I wish others were as knowledgable and diligent about reporting on the abortion issue as she is.
Actually Jen Psaki was the 1st tv person to call the Republicans out for their bullshit full term & post birth abortion lies. She started her show out with it at least 2-3 months ago.
It was fantastic. I recently msg Ali Velshi to scold him for playing a clip of tfg rattling that same crap & not fact checking it afterward by calling it the lie that it is.
Good for you! Psaki is also knowledgable & no bs. Reid & Wallace are good too. Wagner has had Jessica & other knowledgable pro women’s reproductive freedom guests on a few times. I’m thankful for that.
Btw, one can always tell who does their own research before an interview vs who counts on the research staff or intern’s cliff notes & proposed questions. Those relying on cliff notes never ask the best 2nd & 3rd question based on a reply or call out lies.
Alex ran the segment on her show, the segment on the mefi underground was actually reported by Paola Ramos & it was great. A woman Dr from Mexico sending them to women over here at her own expense; & an undocumented woman who was raped several times on the other side of the border & then discovered she was pregnant after crossing. These brown women, who are so despised by many, trying to help others.
"Democrat Marilyn Lands on Tuesday decisively won an Alabama state House seat in a long-held Republican district, notching a special-election victory after centering her campaign on promoting access to abortion and in vitro fertilization." AHHHHHHHHHH YES!!!! 63% to 37%!!!!
Why the so called Supreme Court is even taking this up is beyond me- well let them. Let them knock down another pillar of women's reproductive freedom. Because I believe that the majority of women are already revved up with voting energy and this will put rocket fuel in that energy .... I don't know why Biden doesn't stump on if he gets both houses of congress and wins- here's his immediate agenda... starting with women... and this time CODIFY
The court had to take it up though because the lower courts had ruled against us, first in Amarillo and then in the 5th circuit, both far more extreme than even this court, so the only way to overturn it was to take up this case.
Yes. I think the crazies made a tactical error in bringing this case. It was a weak case and now they've shown their hand. And Comstock was mentioned, so now the Dems need to play that tape and shine sunlight on the oppressive agenda.
Did anyone catch Katy Tur's interview with Hawley today? I listened to it while walking outside. Was very disappointed. Tur was too soft on her. She went after her claim that the doctors in the suit had standing, but she let Hawley spew the nonsense. She let her get away with saying that 1 out of every 25 women who take the pills end up in ERs, and of them 7% have serious complications. She didn't question that. She let Hawley say the stuff that Jessica is rightly railing about.
I like Tur. She seems like a genuinely nice person, but the interview was disappointing for the danger that Hawley poses. She even congratulated her at the end.
I dislike Tur from when she was on Trump's campaign press detail and she did everything she could to undermine Hillary and prop up trump. I don't watch her but she trends a lot on twitter for doing things wrong (like what you are saying).
YES: "... the truth: that they’re dangerous extremists who would rather see women die than abortion be legal. "
This.
If they cared, they'd be outraged that women are being told by doctors and hospitals to wait until they get sicker to come back for care. Never saw Hawley, or an Republican, speak out about that ! It's exactly as Jessica says above -- they would rather see us die. That's our punishment. It is sooooo sick.
Ms Hawley can fuck all the way off: "it’s a lot to ask” for “doctors to go up to the top floor and litigate this with the general counsel when the federal government’s telling them they don’t have a conscience protection.”
A good reference on Anthony Comstock. The man who hated women by Amy Sohn.
I am just wondering what are the insurance companies thinking? Why should they pay for a c section when an abortion would be cheaper? Why pay for blood infusions when abortions are cheaper? And aren't these examples more of a liability for hospitals?
The other thing I been thinking why then should a doctor have to treat a patient because they don't like the patient's race, sex, religion? Would a law this stupid cover that? Or why should a doctor treat an overweight person in the ER if they could be there because of complications from their weight? This just doesn't end.
As to the hospitals- so many are owned now by Catholics, & we know they aren’t doing anything that resembles an abortion.
That is something else we need to start agitating for; the DOJ to bring an antitrust lawsuit against them & stop them from buying up any more hospitals. They are becoming a monopoly
As a retired surgical assistant, I can't give you enough upvotes for this^^^^^^
I like how you think Heather! Yes 🙌 insurance companies don’t want to pay more money 💰 if they don’t have to. Maybe they aren’t paying.
Also if a person doesn’t have insurance then the hospital is stuck paying.
I would like to know more. Hmm 🤔
great piece
For the life of me, I cannot understand why no doctor is saying on air "it is the responsibility of the physician to treat patients according to their individual needs, not according to the political or ideological or religious beliefs of the physician."
I mean, they'd probably need to be ready to retire, but there are plenty of those. Also plenty willing to take the harassment that would come at them. But this was at least at one time spoken of as how medicine was supposed to be, before the culture shift. Now, for a subset, it's "I don't want to" said like a toddler. Get over yourself and treat your patient. Patient comes first. Freaking always.
I was really surprised that the Comstock Law is still on the books. It is the law that can be used to charge people with mailing abortifacients, but it also provides for much more that could be used to control women's choices. The law criminalizes mailing birth control, including pills, condoms, diaphragms etc. It forbids mailing information about women's productive health. I have no doubt that the radical right will eventually take advantage of this. Maybe we should be encouraging our representatives to work to repeal the Comstock law, especially if the Democrats retake the house.
Yeah. What I don't understand is why we can't turn it on them and bring a suit that outlaws the mailing of, say, Viagra? The Comstock Act is pretty broad in saying anything "obscene, lewd or lascivious." That could encompass a lot today, most notably Viagra. Why do we have to just focus on what is says re abortion? I am confused by that, genuinely.
imo the Comstock Act would certainly apply to viagra, if they really want to go there. It’s used to promote lewd & lascivious behavior, right?
Absolutely our elected representatives must get to work on repealing it immediately
Comstock needs to go. If mailing "indecent materials" or however it is phrased is illegal, how long is it before homes are raided for mailing artwork that is deemed inappropriate? Imagine a swat team coming into your home, yourself on the news in handcuffs in your pajamas, or imprisoned. Tangential, but, physicians in this country get raided at home and in their offices by SWAT teams at gunpoint and have their bank accounts and homes seized before they can even hire attorneys FOR PRESCRIBING controlled substances to people in hospice at normal doses under drug war policy. There's been a suicide of a disabled patient post raid who had a gun pointed at their head during a raid. You can bring up footage of some of this online. One physician had a retinal detachment and a heart attack while in prison waiting for a trial. Often the "trials" are administrative law judges of the DEA behind closed doors without a jury and no one is allowed in. Some of these guys are released after years in prison and lives ruined, because they were found innocent, long after being smeared in the media. I see Comstock with "indecent" materials, contraception, abortion, going the same way. Steps to complete control. I don't do well at home; I definitely couldn't manage in a US prison, and I don't want to have to depend on some nut job's idea of what is decent for all my thoughts, activities, entertainment, etc., and that is where they want to take us.
I was actually slightly heartened by Barrett yesterday. While she is not, in general, someone I approve of, she seemed to actually understand the concept of women’s health in the arguments.
This time, don't be fooled. She has said in the past it is no hardship to have a child you can't afford, just drop it off at the nearest fire department.
Barrett is conservative, and she signed on to Dobbs, but she's not a caricature, and she's not a completely unreasonable human being. Oddly enough, none of Trump's three justices, problematic as they are, are as bad as Thomas and Alito (and Son of Sam seems to get worse every year). Not to defend them, for anyone else reading, but just to say that there still seem to be degrees here, and I'm not sure it's helpful to throw every conservative in the same pile, especially when it seems like promoting divisions between them is one of the best ways to stop this onslaught of evil in this country.
Amanda Marcotte in Salon: "Erin Hawley is the latest in a long line of Republican women who have built successful careers by destroying the lives of other women." There really is a special place in hell for the women who do the patriarchy's dirty work and destroy the lives of other women. They think the rules they make for other women won't apply to them.
She's also Josh Hawley's "beard". There is an internet picture of him kissing her, he is as far away from her as he can be, looking like Alfalfa in the little rascals, when he lost a bet and had to kiss Darla. That is not a man who likes women.
Well said a Terri. Sadly some women choose to adopt the “ladder” approach. The style men have been using for years. Two people can’t stand on the same rung. So they push the other person down or up to get ahead and take their place. Every man and woman for themselves mentality. 🤨
Erin Hawley would be the first one to sue the hospital if she lost too much blood or damage done to an organ because of a miscarriage that she had to wait until near death.
Thank you for your outrage, written persuasively. I hardly know what to do with mine. I’m reading the the book “Birth Strike” by Jenny Brown. And here’s a graph from it about the charge Anthony Comstock (who helped outlaw contraception & abortion here in 1873) himself was leading in U.S. between 1860-1880: “He and his minions proceeded to conduct a reign of terror against abortion providers, purveyors of birth control advice, feminist and anarchist speakers, free-love advocates, novelists who mentioned sex, and booksellers....Pill, potions, devices and information on birth control could no longer be sold or sent through the mail”
In the late 1800s!!! Lawrence with Sen. Whitehouse did a segment very recently on how the right wing extremists like Leo network are training judges and lawyers in what is called 'history and tradition doctrine' to interpret the constitution through that perverted lens. With the SCOTUS we have now, yeah, they can drag us back, way back to that period.
Ugh! So much effort to control women....
Not just women. I'm a woman, and I feel as you do, but it's worth adding, this is a window for them to control whomever they want. If we don't stop this now, anyone who pokes their head up or has a contrary thought will be in danger. Think AI. AI, protected by proprietary formulation, is being applied already to medicine without FDA approval, which is supposed to be required, in order to supposedly stop doctor shopping, but really your medication records in most states are open to law enforcement without subpoena or warrant, and they can set you up and use you as they wish if you are slightly out of the ordinary, which many people are without having committed any crime.
Yes, via the PDMP, they track anyone & everyone who gets a prescription for any scheduled medication, opioids, benzodiazepines, ADHD meds, etc
Great job on Alex Wagner tonight! Also a big thank you to Alex Wagner for her reporting. I wish others were as knowledgable and diligent about reporting on the abortion issue as she is.
Actually Jen Psaki was the 1st tv person to call the Republicans out for their bullshit full term & post birth abortion lies. She started her show out with it at least 2-3 months ago.
It was fantastic. I recently msg Ali Velshi to scold him for playing a clip of tfg rattling that same crap & not fact checking it afterward by calling it the lie that it is.
Good for you! Psaki is also knowledgable & no bs. Reid & Wallace are good too. Wagner has had Jessica & other knowledgable pro women’s reproductive freedom guests on a few times. I’m thankful for that.
Btw, one can always tell who does their own research before an interview vs who counts on the research staff or intern’s cliff notes & proposed questions. Those relying on cliff notes never ask the best 2nd & 3rd question based on a reply or call out lies.
Jessica, you were great on Alex Wagner show tonight.
{also, Alex did a segment on a large underground network in TX helping women which is what I heard from a random interaction I had with a TX OBGYN)
Alex ran the segment on her show, the segment on the mefi underground was actually reported by Paola Ramos & it was great. A woman Dr from Mexico sending them to women over here at her own expense; & an undocumented woman who was raped several times on the other side of the border & then discovered she was pregnant after crossing. These brown women, who are so despised by many, trying to help others.
Thank you for your articulate passion.
"Democrat Marilyn Lands on Tuesday decisively won an Alabama state House seat in a long-held Republican district, notching a special-election victory after centering her campaign on promoting access to abortion and in vitro fertilization." AHHHHHHHHHH YES!!!! 63% to 37%!!!!
If we could only replicate this on a national level in November.
We could if enough of us vote for reality.
Wonderful news. My spouse is from Alabama. So glad to hear. They need this so bad 👏
Why the so called Supreme Court is even taking this up is beyond me- well let them. Let them knock down another pillar of women's reproductive freedom. Because I believe that the majority of women are already revved up with voting energy and this will put rocket fuel in that energy .... I don't know why Biden doesn't stump on if he gets both houses of congress and wins- here's his immediate agenda... starting with women... and this time CODIFY
The court had to take it up though because the lower courts had ruled against us, first in Amarillo and then in the 5th circuit, both far more extreme than even this court, so the only way to overturn it was to take up this case.
Yep... their judge shopping strategy they use quite frequently - like a political chess game instead of what the courts should actually be for....
Yes. I think the crazies made a tactical error in bringing this case. It was a weak case and now they've shown their hand. And Comstock was mentioned, so now the Dems need to play that tape and shine sunlight on the oppressive agenda.
Did anyone catch Katy Tur's interview with Hawley today? I listened to it while walking outside. Was very disappointed. Tur was too soft on her. She went after her claim that the doctors in the suit had standing, but she let Hawley spew the nonsense. She let her get away with saying that 1 out of every 25 women who take the pills end up in ERs, and of them 7% have serious complications. She didn't question that. She let Hawley say the stuff that Jessica is rightly railing about.
I like Tur. She seems like a genuinely nice person, but the interview was disappointing for the danger that Hawley poses. She even congratulated her at the end.
I don’t like Tur, she is one of the worst ppl in the msnbc lineup; she’s WAY to easy
I dislike Tur from when she was on Trump's campaign press detail and she did everything she could to undermine Hillary and prop up trump. I don't watch her but she trends a lot on twitter for doing things wrong (like what you are saying).
YES: "... the truth: that they’re dangerous extremists who would rather see women die than abortion be legal. "
This.
If they cared, they'd be outraged that women are being told by doctors and hospitals to wait until they get sicker to come back for care. Never saw Hawley, or an Republican, speak out about that ! It's exactly as Jessica says above -- they would rather see us die. That's our punishment. It is sooooo sick.
This is one of the best AEDs yet.
Ms Hawley can fuck all the way off: "it’s a lot to ask” for “doctors to go up to the top floor and litigate this with the general counsel when the federal government’s telling them they don’t have a conscience protection.”